Sarah Lee
Creative Director @ The Talent Manager
London
Boost Freelancer Welfare & Recruit Inclusively
Recently active recruiters
There has been a lot of talk recently about companies not acknowledging job applications - let alone feeding back. We understand how frustrating this is,... Read more
There has been a lot of talk recently about companies not acknowledging job applications - let alone feeding back. We understand how frustrating this is, especially in these tough times and we want to review what we can do to help.
How can we persuade employers that small actions here can make a big difference? How can we use collective force to stamp out this bad practice? In short what can The TM be doing to help change the culture?
Over the years we have built various tools to facilitate feedback. We've been fighting this battle for a while!
From the manage jobs tool within their account, recruiters can select all those unsuccessful candidates and respond to all in one go. We even auto fill their 'respond all' email with a standard reply to make that process easier and faster for them, whilst giving them the choice to personalise if they prefer. We tried stopping recruiters posting another job until they had fed back on the first, although that has been difficult to enforce and to be fair to the recruiters it is often something that is not practical especially when they are crewing mulitple jobs at a time.
One of our ideas is to send more regular email reminders embedding easy shortlist or reject options. We've been talking about site modifications and mandatory options versus gentle persuasion. Can we run reports and celebrate the companies with the best feedback records we are wondering? Is there a way of using gamification to celebrate best practice?
But first off we'd love to garner YOUR thoughts. We want YOU to feedback to us. Tell us in the comments IF and HOW you have been affected by the lack of feedback and any ideas you might have for what could be done.
How can we persuade employers that small actions here can make a big difference? How can we use collective force to stamp out this bad practice? In short what can The TM be doing to help change the culture?
Over the years we have built various tools to facilitate feedback. We've been fighting this battle for a while!
From the manage jobs tool within their account, recruiters can select all those unsuccessful candidates and respond to all in one go. We even auto fill their 'respond all' email with a standard reply to make that process easier and faster for them, whilst giving them the choice to personalise if they prefer. We tried stopping recruiters posting another job until they had fed back on the first, although that has been difficult to enforce and to be fair to the recruiters it is often something that is not practical especially when they are crewing mulitple jobs at a time.
One of our ideas is to send more regular email reminders embedding easy shortlist or reject options. We've been talking about site modifications and mandatory options versus gentle persuasion. Can we run reports and celebrate the companies with the best feedback records we are wondering? Is there a way of using gamification to celebrate best practice?
But first off we'd love to garner YOUR thoughts. We want YOU to feedback to us. Tell us in the comments IF and HOW you have been affected by the lack of feedback and any ideas you might have for what could be done.
Edited on 27th Feb 2024 14:34pm
70 Likes
Sarah Lee
If people think it would be helpful for us to run an 'open house' or 'town hall' zoom call about this very issue this is also something we would be very happy to do. Its often easier to discuss these things and we could show you mock ups of some of the ideas we are proposing...
Simon Brant
@SarahLee Hi Sarah - I think we have corresponded on this in the past and I would happily join an open forum to thrash around some ideas and see what you propose. Under various wellbeing policies do PACT suggest how independents should conduct themselves when handling recruitment? I agree with Natalie's comments regarding a covering letter and CV they need to access both before being able to respond. Perhaps a few companies should start being named and shamed - particularly if big players.
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Dan Lewis
@SimonBrant - That was my first thought too, name and shame. Not sure if that is a bit underhand or not? Especially as it maybe only the few within any given organisation.
Simon Brant
@DanLewis - Hi Dan those folk are still employed by the company they are meant to be representing in a good light I think it's not about being underhand it's about those companies respecting the freelance tv community a bit better surely.
Julia Rooke
@SarahLee Hi Sarah, re job Ads. I think its really important that indies remove jobs as soon as they have gone. This is worth campaigning for. Otherwise we are busting a gut, drafting application letters, for nothing. Secondly, why do some indies advertise but never even look at your cover letter? Presumably because the job has gone. There is one major culprit and I have vowed never to apply to them again. Wont't name and shame here. I think the way to change the culture is to lean on the Execs to train their PMs and Coords to do this as a matter of decency. What do you think?
Steven McVeigh
Represent their response rate on their company page and the Job posting:
Green: Responds to 70%> of applicants
Amber: Responds to between 30% > 70% of applicants received
Red: Responds to less than 30% of applicants
Hard to enforce anything too stringent as making using this service unattractive to a company wouldn't help any of us, but would be interesting if a bit of open statistical public shaming might give them some impetus to do things better...
Green: Responds to 70%> of applicants
Amber: Responds to between 30% > 70% of applicants received
Red: Responds to less than 30% of applicants
Hard to enforce anything too stringent as making using this service unattractive to a company wouldn't help any of us, but would be interesting if a bit of open statistical public shaming might give them some impetus to do things better...
Sarah Lee
@StevenMcVeigh This is a great idea and we have been talking about 'glassdoor' type ratings as a development of this too
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Steven McVeigh
@SarahLee Cool. Also reflecting on some of these other messages, maybe a 'shortlist' function for the employer to tick - so you know you've made it past the 'hunter gatherer' and in front of the exec who will actually be doing the hiring...
Will Parry
@StevenMcVeigh I completely agree with this! Also, the very worst are companies who invite you for interview, then never tell you if you’ve been successful. After a while you get the message, but only after you’ve sent four or five messages with no response. All it takes is a simple one line email. ‘Thank you for your time coming to see us. Unfortunately this time we’ve chosen to go with another candidate. All the best’. It really is that simple, and ‘being busy’ isn’t an excuse.
Sarah Lee
@StevenMcVeigh Yes exactly - what's difficult is getting the timing of us asking right. Because some companies will want to get all applications in before reviewing any of them which is best practice ) and others will be happy to rule candidates in or out as and when each application comes through. If we leave asking them until the posting expires it is often too late as they crewed it weeks before and are onto other things by then but equally if we ask as they go along some might say too soon
Steven McVeigh
@StevenMcVeigh Fair point. I suppose improving matters for the community at large might have to involve cracking a few eggs!
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Rosie Pooley
I’ve applied for three jobs at the same company through Talent Manager (all of which I was completely qualified to do) and only for the third job application was my cover letter read and CV downloaded. It is so disheartening after putting in time and effort to write the cover letters and then the applications are ignored entirely. I understand it’s quiet and so there might be hundreds of applications but it would be nice to know that the application has at least been acknowledged in some way.
Sarah Lee
@RosiePooley I totally agree
Jemma Jupp
@SarahLee it is crushing not to have any reply. As you say, not particularly hard for the recruiters
Amanda Moran
I think TM should operate a 3 strikes style policy. It is extremely unprofessional & bad manners not to respond. Companies have been getting away with 'owing to the amount of applicants we will receive we can only respond to to successful applicants' before they even know how many applicants they will have. It's also lazy. The people putting up the jobs need to remember that we are ALL at some point applying for jobs just like them & remember what is like to hear nothing in return
Peter Strachan
Ghosting or a generic cut and pasted note. Hmmm? 🤔
Lucy Lomas
Slightly off piste addition to this moan I’m not quite sure why we can’t get a chat with talent managers in this “reset” or at other flat periods of employment - it would seem like now is exactly the time for companies to diversify by talking to potential staff that they haven’t booked before - and we’re all going to have to ask for breaks in the new landscape so now would be the ideal moment to look at where those breaks would come with minimal risk
Sarah Lee
@LucyLomas This is exactly why we are upping the number of in- person and online events. Anotherone is happening in Manchester next week. We are saying to the companies that even if they are short on commissions at mo - hearing this from the horses mouth is what the freelancers now need
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Lucy Lomas
@SarahLee good to hear - hopefully that will develop into elevated discussions about how freelancers can diversify into growth areas and rebuild their cv for the new landscape
Lesley Brandon
Love all these suggestions, I'm in for a discussion - been victim so many times.
Sarah Lee
@LesleyBrandon Great. We will keep you posted re details of the zoom
Simon Vacher
@SarahLee Finally! I think it should be in all recruiting companies policy that they respond to applicants. The benefit far outweighs the ignore pattern that has been established in recent years and it doesn’t take more than 20-30 seconds to write out a basic response. It’s the decent thing to do. The benefits overall are better communication and supportive to our freelance community.
Freya Ward-Smith
@SarahLee I’d say it even goes beyond frustrating at the moment - it’s completely crushing because it leaves you hoping for longer and not then prioritising other sources of income. It basically gives you false hope which borders on cruel in the current climate. I was in email contact with a company who said I’d be a “great fit” for them should something come up and said they’d be keen to meet in person and chat. (My cv is a bit niche so there’s not that many companies in London I can work for). A job appeared - I applied immediately - enthusiastically followed up on email contact - they read the cover letter…. And nothing. No official rejection. Haven’t even downloaded the cv. Also no reply to my email. It’s just soul destroying. It’s such a simple thing but it would make such a big difference to actually be respected enough to be told when you’re unsuccessful.
Stephen Foote
@FreyaWard-Smith I completely agree! You think you may have this big job on, and err on deterring other people from booking you…. Then it all evaporates into thin air! I must also say, though, that when the ball is on the other foot and you pull out of a booking then they get really pissed off! There needs to be a system of mutual respect, and sadly this is not the case these days…
nigel paterson
Can you tell if CV or letter has been accessed or read. I was contacted for a reference by a talent manager - from a company I had recently applied for a job - (and heard nothing). Despite being very well qualified for position they hadn't even seen my CV. My overall experience is that it's v rare to hear from a company after an application - it feels as if the application is a shout into an abyss 8/10
SIMON PHILLIPS
So many good suggestions here already. Rating companies on a percentage of responses with a traffic light system makes sense. Plus a “three strikes” rule - don’t TM already have such a rule for applicants. But fundamentally it’s a master and servant relationship - and the servants are all paying for this ! somehow TM you need to make this relationship more equal - education first then some sort of shaming and even a temp block for repeat offenders
Sarah Lee
@SIMONPHILLIPS Interestingly I think that most recruiters acknowledge this is bad practice and most think it is only others doing it. Even if they are doing it themselves!
Raquel Cuevas
I understand that some roles advertised can amass hundreds of applicants and that can be quite a feat especially if it's a smaller crew or one person managing that on top of their duties but it really is disheartening when you've put so much time, research and hope into an application - I've spent days on some of them, only to never hear a word. One thing that I've found helpful is when applicants share once they've been contacted, so maybe a space within ads where applicants can share that?
Becs Hall
@RaquelCuevas I like this idea! Although really we want the companies to be responding 🤔
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Sarah Lee
@RaquelCuevas Interesting idea although I worry it might lead to added anxiety if some had heard and others not. Especially given that those who hadnt yet heard might have good news coming...
Stephen Foote
This is a problem that has been rife throughout the industry for years. I’m not sure what (or if) the solution is. As a DoP on the receiving end, where we are asked if we are available to travel to the other side of the planet in a weeks time, and you assume that it will be you because it’s short notice and lots of things need to be organised (carnets etc). Then you never hear back, so you cal, them, only to be told they went with someone else! It’s just really poor etiquette.
Sarah Lee
@StephenFoote A lot of our problems would be solved if there was a more realistic timescale between green light and start date
Adam Horton
The lack of acknowledgment when you apply for a job I have found to be hugely disrespectful. It is even worse when you have an interview and then you just get ghosted. You'd think the fact many of the people interviewing will have been freelance themselves, at some point, so they should be more empathetic. Freelancing can be really tough on the mental health and ironically I have found it is the companies who claim to care most about employee mental health to be the worst behaved.
Sarah Lee
@AdamHorton Agree ghosting post interview is a whole other level in terms of disrespect!
George Hristov
I think the "If you haven't heard from us within two weeks, assume you're unsuccessful" line could simplify the process a lot.
Enforce this sentence as mandatory for all employers.
Enforce this sentence as mandatory for all employers.
Sarah Lee
@GeorgeHristov Thats an interesting twist on the optional sentence ' we might only be able to get back to successful candidates' as it at least pins the recruiters down to a timeline
Paul Crompton
@SarahLee I don’t mind a rejection letter. I don’t see why its such a big deal to write a polite reply. Are they that busy that they can’t be bothered to respond?
https://youtu.be/vC6nGZ-nKrU?si=tLqw3wcgfsMVbF_b
https://youtu.be/vC6nGZ-nKrU?si=tLqw3wcgfsMVbF_b
Sarah Lee
@PaulCrompton Letters! A blast from the past.. Makes me realise that despite the process getting easier for recruiters the response rate has got worse
Christopher Bowyer
@SarahLee some interesting ideas but I can’t help thinking that the companies who are recruiting will be keeping an eye on this post then blacklisting potential employees. Even though that’s not right I can’t help thinking it can happen.
Sarah Lee
@ChristopherBowyer I honestly don’t think that is a worry. I think recruiters are timestarved and often forced into working this way because of too tight a gap between green light and go but I can’t think of any of them who wouldn’t agree that this way of working needs to change.
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Matt Born
@ChristopherBowyer I doubt it very much. Most companies and recruiters know that they should be getting back to people but either feel they don't have time (they do! there are quick and easy ways through TM to do so) or - more often - aren't quite sure how to respond and (I suspect) feel bad making the rejection ''official''. So it's partly about educating them and changing that culture.
Ian Allardyce
Perhaps TM should make it as easy for the employer as possible, given the volume of applications. So they could have options to easily categorise each non-selection by; i.e Too Experienced, Not experienced enough, wrong credits, too many applications, etc. The results could show up on the Applications dashboard. It would be better than nothing to at least know a broad reason you weren't selected.
Sarah Lee
@IanAllardyce I think you are right that it has to be as easy as possible
Tracy Garrett
Agree with Adam Horton above, I attended a face to face meeting recently which felt very positive and expected a response by the end of the week. Not even the courtesy of an email. Just a quick email to say, "Sorry on this occasion we've decided to appoint someone else / more relevant experience" would be fine. At least you are not hanging on waiting. Just very bad form.
Sarah Lee
@TracyGarrett It is particularly awful after a meeting
Christopher Cranidge
This is such a non-issue.
I couldn’t imagine anything worse than waiting to see if I was successful for a job, getting an email from the company, only to find out it’s a pat on the head “we have seen you” and that’s it.
That’s even more frustrating. It’s a waste of employers time. It’s a waste of my dopamine.
If you’re the sort of person that needs constant reassurance then maybe an industry as volatile as TV isn’t for you. There are worse practices to be focusing on.
I couldn’t imagine anything worse than waiting to see if I was successful for a job, getting an email from the company, only to find out it’s a pat on the head “we have seen you” and that’s it.
That’s even more frustrating. It’s a waste of employers time. It’s a waste of my dopamine.
If you’re the sort of person that needs constant reassurance then maybe an industry as volatile as TV isn’t for you. There are worse practices to be focusing on.
Christopher Cranidge
@ChristopherCranidge
If employers are going to add constructive feedback - I can totally get behind that.
But realistically that’s not going to happen and it’s unfair to put that burden on a company receiving 100’s of applications.
Apply for the job, then forget about it, is the best advice.
If employers are going to add constructive feedback - I can totally get behind that.
But realistically that’s not going to happen and it’s unfair to put that burden on a company receiving 100’s of applications.
Apply for the job, then forget about it, is the best advice.
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Sarah Lee
@ChristopherCranidge I’m impressed with your resilience but I don’t think the onus should be on the freelancer. I think it’s natural and fair enough to want to know the outcome of an application
Christopher Cranidge
@SarahLee
I hear that. And in life unfair things happen. I don’t know how healthy it is in the longterm to encourage people to have constant reassurance.
If people want that, there are other careers they can navigate to. But ultimately every choice in life, every job we take, will have a negative aspect attached to it.
I hear that. And in life unfair things happen. I don’t know how healthy it is in the longterm to encourage people to have constant reassurance.
If people want that, there are other careers they can navigate to. But ultimately every choice in life, every job we take, will have a negative aspect attached to it.
Matt Ainsworth
@ChristopherCranidge @SarahLee I think I agree that feedback - or basically ANY info - would elevate an auto response into something really kind & useful. Companies could be encouraged to add some sort of generic explanation: EG, "We had 3000 applications". They could also be reminded that applicants know if their CV has been viewed or downloaded. Tbh I've had the auto-no-thanks when they've not even viewed my CV and find that more disheartening than hearing nothing
Simon Brant
@ChristopherCranidge I think the point being made is that companies advertise posts you send in a covering letter and C.V. and they often don't even bother to open a covering letter or look at the C.V. What's the point of advertising a job TM or indeed applying via TM if the production companies don't even bother to open the documents. Many folk writing on here have been in the industry 20 plus years and are pretty hard skinned. We're trying to salvage a minimum level of response.
Anika Pilnei
It’s a great idea and would help freelancers’ mental health and feeling of self worth to know we are even being acknowledged to exist with a generic email. It would be even better to know why an application was rejected but that’s almost utopian… or maybe just reserved if in the last 5 applicants. And fair enough when looking at the state of affairs in the industry. The truth is that by the time the ad hits TM the job role may already be filled by someone who knows someone and they just go through the hoops to see what else is out there for next time… Or the part-time working TM is so swamped that they give up by applicant 250. With companies as understaffed as they are, wishing for better rules of engagement is somewhat naive and not worth pinning any hopes on at this point in the game IMHO. Things would need to improve across the board economically to facilitate this kind of change. I have also heard from SPs and HOPs that got abusive emails by freelancers down the lines of “why didn’t I get the job etc”. Needless to say that won’t help folks!
I wonder… Who has actually got jobs via TM applications in the last 18months? What are the statistics… that would be really useful to know. How many applicants for a PD role? Was the final candidate chosen via a TM application? Just knowing that would actually help expose what TM is worth, and to what extent the industry is working its “I know someone who knows someone” and “Let me hire the exact same team from last year to be on the safe side” mechanisms (from which admittedly we have all benefitted at one point or another).
I wonder… Who has actually got jobs via TM applications in the last 18months? What are the statistics… that would be really useful to know. How many applicants for a PD role? Was the final candidate chosen via a TM application? Just knowing that would actually help expose what TM is worth, and to what extent the industry is working its “I know someone who knows someone” and “Let me hire the exact same team from last year to be on the safe side” mechanisms (from which admittedly we have all benefitted at one point or another).
Sarah Lee
@AnikaPilnei Getting comprehensive data is complicated as it involves the companies feeding back to us as well as the individuals. I agree with your point that understaffing won’t help but I do think the fact that so many people want change is in our favour against that
Annette Gordon
I would like to suggest that more talent managers make the effort to talk to a longlist of candidates before deciding who to put forward to Exec/Series Producer for the job. I feel that very little effort is made by production companies to actually find out about the candidates. Lots of playing it safe which leads to people ending up making the same show over and over.
Sarah Lee
@AnnetteGordon yes overly cautious crewing is undoubtedly a scourge
Geoff Harris
I like Simon's idea to name and shame some of the big players, but otherwise...I apply for a lot of jobs on LinkedIn, less here, and some respond but largely not. I kinda think that's reasonable as most jobs do get over 100 applications, and really, they can't be bothered. Of course, those that do reply, do so with a standard email, so which ever way, it's still a reject. When I get the few letters to my own company, from actors and crew, I always reply, even briefly.
Suzanne Mitchell
As a filmmaker and television producer who is married to a person in the tech industry this lack of acknowledgment is not only in our industry but it a product of our time. Many recruiters use ATS (Automatic Screening) software to pick out keywords in resumes. If the software doesn't find the keywords then you are not even passed on to the recruiter.
Sarah Lee
@SuzanneMitchell yes which is worse!
Leah O'Kane
Impossible for entry level positions! Very little point job posting if you’re not even reviewing the applications! So many graduates not getting an opportunity in the industry after their studies :(
Michelle Billington
I stopped using the site and others due to this reason, everything seems to come via FB now or who you know, would be nice to know how far you get as explained above last 5 etc as you start to feel your time is a waste of time, it is not just our industry I agree, I also feel if they are going to hire in house don't bother advertising as these applications take up more time, this needs to change across the board, they also need to be more open to transferable skills, many off us can cross genre
Tasneem Maqsood
@SarahLee I have applied for 5 jobs and only got one interview. No feedback from.other jobs applied for about why I was not a right fit for them. We spend ages crafting our cvs and cover letters so companies should do the same with responding. Also ca TM do more courses on how to write a cover letter. You do lots of CV workshops but not letters. Thanks
Sarah Lee
@TasneemMaqsood check out thr on demand learning area - most of the TMs have talked about cover letters and all of their videos are there
Zoe Bickerton
I absolutely agree employers should get back to interviewees. Just applicants trickier though.
There was a comment from someone on FB recently who'd received the generic thanks but no thanks email on TM recently, but could see that their CV hadn't been opened - it just made the process more crushing. In reality that would be the situation for a lot of applicants, especially in the current climate where even more CVs than usual are being received.
There was a comment from someone on FB recently who'd received the generic thanks but no thanks email on TM recently, but could see that their CV hadn't been opened - it just made the process more crushing. In reality that would be the situation for a lot of applicants, especially in the current climate where even more CVs than usual are being received.
Zoe Bickerton
@ZoeBickerton ‘We received over 100 CVs and already had more than enough amazing candidates before we got to yours’ isn’t feedback any of us need when we’re down!
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Sarah Lee
@ZoeBickerton Also that is so irresponsible because the very last CV they received may well have been the person most suited for the job.
Christine Hjalager
I understand that for every job there are 100s of applicants. However the difficult thing is, that when you dont get any feedback from job applications or the bare minimum, you dont know if you are doing anything wrong and could improve something to get the job. Or if you are just unlucky because someone else got the job. It's very difficult to improve. And since you never get a response it feels like all the effort and time and part of you you put into an application is just sent into nothing.
Deirdre Donnelly
I agree with Christine - I have applied for several jobs via TM and other platforms and have only heard back from two companies. I am at a lose to know how to proceed. I have like many people applied for jobs which I am overqualified for so it is disheartening to hear nothing back from most applications. While companies may be inundated with applications surely there is a way they can reply to at least give assurance they'll keep CVs on file for future reference.
Georgina Love
On this site, there is something in place where employers can flag if you’re submitting applications for roles you are not qualified for. I think it would be helpful if applicants could flag jobs they have applied for and have not heard back from and, if enough flags are raised, the company is restricted from posting on tm until each application has received a response
Mark Sarll Jr
I personally find a lot of companies either want your application but don't respond back is an algorithmic matter. It frustrates me greatly because if you don't fit the certain keystroke words, you'll be ignored. Not everyone can be Superman or Albert Einstein, some just want a good opportunity to climb up the ladder as it used to be for the workplace.
Mark Stephen Hughes
If you've done the interview try to give a time for response for the outcome. Understand there are other possible candidates to see but I've been left checking my emails for days on end after an interview and had to chase to see whether or not I had the job or not. This left me in an awkward position with another potential employer because I could not say to them whether or not I was fully onboard their project. Just be open about when you're going to get back to us!
Jonathan Young
This may have been said already ? Is it possible to place a flag inside the IT infrastructure at TM? Customer service databases like Hubspot use this to see who has opened targeted selling emails. My invoice programme Xero also has this. I can see when my invoice has been opened and viewed by the recipient email address. This way we can all see who is viewing then ghosting.
Sarah Lee
@JonathanYoung it is and we do - the problem is the info is becoming less and less accurate over time as more and more companies have email privacy settings which prevent detection
John Bonny
Sadly, this is yet another area where the television industry falls woefully short of what it should be doing. Could you imagine a solicitor going through various rounds of interview only to never hear back? Almost all applicants take the time to craft unique and tailored covering letters yet they're very rarely even viewed, never mind acknowledged. People who don't work in TV are astounded when I tell them about common practices. It's not ok.
Melissa Williams-Sambrano
Someone in the comments mentioned recruiters not taking the time to read or open CVs and just reading cover letters. I agree this is somewhat insulting. At the very least read through the entire application, CV included. Providing feedback, when the applicant is not being considered for the next phase, would given them an idea of what shortcomings they may need to work on to improve themselves. It may appear to be extra work for the recruiter but it will be helpful.
Patrick Acum
In the TV industry, something like 80% of freelance work is given to people they know - I think the actual figure was higher in the sky/bectu survey. Sending in cv's is almost a waste of time. My wife's exec at the bbc said his inbox was overwhelmed to the point of his email becoming basically unusable as he was receiving thousands of cvs every day. Its a pretty soul crushing experience, I did a chase round last week to at least feel proactive - didn't get a single reply,
Anika Pilnei
@PatrickAcum You nailed it. As someone once said it’s not about what you can do it’s about who you know… and further, being in the right place at the right time. I did a few rounds in January and did get replies mainly because they are all companies I have worked for on several occasions so there is a connection of sorts.
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Sarah Lee
@PatrickAcum You are right to a certain extent but even if recruiters want to give the job to someone they know ( and it happens as it’s about trust )they still have to see who in that category is available. We’ve done a lot of work here at TM so when they are searching the site they are prompted to ‘turn the search into a post’
A. D Cooper
This ghosting has become the norm across most industries - not just production. As an applicant you are deluded into thinking you're being proactive and applying for possible jobs - and feeling somewhat cheered that you've spent so much time doing so - when in fact all that effort and energy disappears into an internet black hole.
Michael Bolsover
We used to get "Thank you for your interest in Central" stock replies from applications for internal jobs at Central ITV in the 80's, so lack of personal replies and feedback is not new. Recruiters need to be reminded that we're not just an entry in a spreadsheet cell, but a real person trying to organise their working life too. Maybe it's a financial penalty that's needed. A discount for recruiters who play nicely? Rewarding those that respect the "Talent" you "Manage".
Sarah Lee
@MichaelBolsover it’s a fine line and we need to be careful as if we alienate recruiters we will drive them to FB which doesn’t help any of us. FB is a real threat to our industries efforts to diversify. Also it’s free so recruiters are tempted anyway but FB recruiting with closed groups and gatekeepers controlling who ‘can and can’t ‘ be part of the club is a regressive backward step. Plus there’s no obligation nor mechanism for recruiters to feedback from there
Kieron Townend
In 20yrs I've had maybe 2 jobs from applying with a cover letter or CV. Whole thing is broken. All last job referrals, luck, showreel at best. Not replying to people is cruel and profoundly lazy. It happens even when I've been approached cold by a production and offered a job. Generally trying to give less f*cks about it has helped me cope. But through TM, surely there is some code to gather and publish data on who replies and as mentioned above give them a reply "hygiene" rating?
Adam Young
There's nothing I can really add that hasn't been said already.
Ultimately for me, it sets a 'tone' for the culture across the industry: "You're all disposable, count yourselves lucky if you're selected, shut up, don't complain, if we click our fingers you better come running." etc etc
Freelancers don't feel that sense of respect or appreciation - how one words a job post or responds to an application can really dial the volume of morale up or down.
Ultimately for me, it sets a 'tone' for the culture across the industry: "You're all disposable, count yourselves lucky if you're selected, shut up, don't complain, if we click our fingers you better come running." etc etc
Freelancers don't feel that sense of respect or appreciation - how one words a job post or responds to an application can really dial the volume of morale up or down.
Daniella Shafai
Thank you for allowing us the space to discuss this! I have applied for 30 jobs using Talent Manger and have heard back from 1 out of the 30. It's left me feeling as if my efforts are being disregarded, and unseen. I have 7 years experience, and love what I do but these last two years have been massively soul destroying. Making companies use a mandatory option, of responding to applications should be enforced. This would allow us freelancers to feel seen rather than virtual application ghosts!
Amanda Moran
@DaniellaShafai I recently received a rejection email telling me that I don't have enough experience. I have 28 year's experience. Even though it was obviously a cut and paste job from a junior member of staff it was no less galling!
Daniella Shafai
I also wanted to add, can we please have a discussion with employers that only allow applicants to apply for roles with the most specific requirements. Researchers, AP's & Producers work across an array of varying topics which are extremely transferable regardless of the topic. To expect an individual to only have 'Science' 'History' 'Dating' 'Property' etc is very problematic. We should be encouraging applicants to diversify their CV's/experience, not pigeon hole them to one singular genre.
Sarah Lee
@DaniellaShafai This different ( although I agree equally gauling issue ) is a harder one to crack I think
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Adam Young
@DaniellaShafai I always say, it's like expecting a chef to be only capable of making one kind of dish.
Sarah Lee
@AdamYoung Great analogy!
Miranda Stern
There could be a drop down box for employers to give general reasoning: 'not enough experience', 'mistakes/errors in app', 'incorrect skillset', 'late' or 'role already filled' then that would be a quick response which would allow some scope for feedback. It can be so demoralising to hear nothing, and can feel like a never ending echochamber. Applicants could then chart how they might change tack, or see recurring reasons, and at least feel heard/seen rather than gaslit.
Michelle Fobler
When I joined TV (BBC in the good ol days) all applications were responded to. Firstly acknowledged, then to let you know if you were successful or not. There should be protocols for those in hiring positions. PACT should get involved. I have only ever received one response in all the years I have been with TM. Agree with all the above comments. Another bugbear is that Indies totally disregard CV's unless you have worked on a very similar show previously. V short-sighted in my opinion.
Sarah Lee
@MichelleFobler Thanks for thr thought about Pact. We work together with Bectu but you are right we need to onboard Pact. I know I keep saying this but I genuinely believe recruiters want this change too. Most of the TMs we work with need more time to do this but do recognise it’s a change that needs to be made
George Hristov
@SarahLee Thank you. Yes, I think if there is a timeline, at least people will know not to have keep waiting after two weeks.
Transparency through the process solves the problem.
Transparency through the process solves the problem.
Sam Goss
Hi - I am not sure if this has been mentioned above - but sometimes the deadline for applying does,'t match when the job needs to start. I appreciate recruiters want to keep options open (I know we ALL want to keep options open)! but I wonder if it is something you could try to encourage. Is it possible then to generate an 'auto response' even - on that date - with employers only really needing to tick a box/button for the candidates they have shortlisted, and the others get an autoresponse?
Sarah Lee
@SamGoss yes interesting. We have recently changed the job post form to make it easier for us to tell us their ideal timeline for recruiting with a view to doing just this
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Sam Goss
@SarahLee Thank you Sarah. I take your point on other posts about a delay not always being the recruiters fault - names have to be sent to commissioners etc. But maybe there could also be a button saying something like " Unfortunately there has been a delay in the decision making so we will be in touch again [soon]. Apologies for the inconvenience. That was one I got from BBC last year. (I didn't get the job)
Jon Clemens-Mann
@SarahLee I have only ever received 2 or 3 standard rejections from the many, many jobs I’ve applied for through this platform. I agree with the many responses above. Is it worth preventing a company posting a new advert without notifying candidates from a previous position after the advert has expired? That way they can still post multiple adverts if crewing up at once while they remain open but not once each has expired.
Sarah Lee
@JonClemens-Mann we have had this system in place for a while. But the recruiters loathe it and in many instances we’ve been forced to turn it off. To be fair to the recruiters they often have a point. ( the choice hasn’t yet been made, it’s out of their hands, the project has been delayed etc etc)
Jon Clemens-Mann
An additional bug bear (while we’re at it) are employers who advertise for a senior position, then a couple of weeks later remove the post and replace it for a more junior role with an identical job description. It appears they do so when they realise they can’t afford to pay for experience. It’s really poor practice and something I see again and again. Companies should know what they can afford to pay before advertising and what they can expect for that rate. I don’t know how to combat this except for maybe transparency on rates when advertising.
Sarah Lee
@JonClemens-Mann Agree this is VERY poor practice
Matt Ainsworth
I'd find it helpful if TM could make it a little more transparent to freelancers about what happens on the recruiters' side of the site. For instance, at the other end, does the account holder get an email when I apply for something, or is it a screen full of names that appears under each job ad they've posted? What do they have to do to read the cover note, view a profile, or download a CV?
And would there be implications to showing 'number of applicants' to a job?
And would there be implications to showing 'number of applicants' to a job?
Sarah Lee
@MattAinsworth The idea of the zoom is to go through this process. We are very happy to. It’s complicated as it depends on whether thr companies elect to review cvs on our platform or via their inboxes. We try and encourage via us as that way they are more likely to use shortlist and reject tools. CN you join the zoom? . I’d love to show you and others this journey in more detail and to hear your thoughts?
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Matt Ainsworth
@SarahLee Hi Sarah - thanks for the reply - good to know how it works at the recruiter end! I'd be happy to join the Zoom. Have u scheduled it yet? Couldn't see
Sarah Lee
@MattAinsworth We hope to pin down the date for it within the next few days
Laura McCombie
Perhaps there is a way of showing production companies these comments (anonymously) Unless you’re on the receiving end of all this perhaps they don’t even think that freelancers are bothered?
Sarah Lee
@LauraMcCombie This is such a good idea and one we think we should absolutely take up. Thankyou!
Adam Young
I also wanted to add: I've been doing this for 14 years, worked on over 500+ projects and I'm still being told that I don't have enough experience.
Plus - I don't think I've actually gained a job via Talent Manager since joining. It's all been through FB closed groups, Talented People or someone has recommended me.
Plus - I don't think I've actually gained a job via Talent Manager since joining. It's all been through FB closed groups, Talented People or someone has recommended me.
Scott Toms
I have lots to say about treatment by employers, such as my favourite one recently "We have closed the position so we are sorry...." but my main issue is that I am totally behind the idea about having some guidelines for applicants about applications, such as your three strikes rule for the applicants. The Runners facebook group has strict rules about asking questions about roles on adverts placed on it. But what about the employers? They are just left to treat us badly
Scott Toms
@ScottToms I applied for a role and when I didn't get it I politely asked for feedback and her direct quote "If I could be bothered to get your CV and look then I would but I'm not going to" We mean nothing to them.
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Sarah Lee
@ScottToms That is just plain rude. So shocked and sorry to hear that. . Re the “policing” of the recruiters - the TM does do this in various ways- ( for example we turn down job posts if we think they are exploitative, they don’t meet our standards or they breach minimum wage legislation) and we are open to doing that it in other ways - hence this post- but as someone said above we need to be careful not to alienate recruiters as that won’t help any of us!
Warren Spencer
@ScottToms that's shocking
Scott Toms
@ScottToms I was reminded by fb today of another incident where I was contacted about a role (I hadn't applied for) was told I would get the call sheet later that day. An hour later I saw the job advertised on FB, a further hour later the post said position filled. I only had the email off the fb post as the landline I was called off was closed as it was after hours. I was told the director had gone with someone they'd worked with before. I was left devestated
Chris Greenwood
I've been a TM member for over 12 years. In that time, I've had responses to job applications when I've been shortlisted, callled for interview etc but I've never had contact from a job for which I was unsuccessful..... until last month(!) when Freeform had the decency to write to thank me for my application & inform me that I'd been unsuccessful on this occasion. I haven't worked for the company before but I now think very highly of them. Well done Freeform! Thank you!
Simon Brant
Perhaps a more subtle way of naming a shaming companies would be a TM version of trust pilot for production companies specifically surrounding recruitment and duty of care around the well being aspects of their recruitment process. This could have a positive impact as those getting it right or moving in the right direction might just lift those companies not doing so well or certainly not giving the process the investment it might require to do it properly.
Sarah Lee
@SimonBrant This is exactly my thinking. Naming and shaming will simply drive the recruiters to places where the accountability is zero and then only some groups of people will get to see their jobs. I mention gamification in my original post as I think shining a light on the positive examples is the way to go. Like @ChrisGreenwood just suggested too
Richard Strong
This is so common that I now think of someone looking at or downloading my CV on talent manager as the only acknowledgment I'll get.
Fiona Davis
Sad state of affairs how the freelance community is treated really.
Warren Spencer
It's been this way since I started applying for film work in 2000. Made a film which I produced singlehandedly, that showed more than enough aptitude and ability. Sent around 120-130 spec letters out. Ok they weren't for advertised jobs so they were under no obligation to answer, but got almost no response, or even an encouraging good job, but we've got no vacancies reply. Other than someone very high up at Channel; 5 who was very kind in responding.
Rachel Jardine
@SarahLee I’m a really experienced PD with a great CV and I’ve applied for about 40 jobs with TM since I joined. Most of these have been a close match to my skills and experience. However, in a high proportion of instances no one even views my covering letter. Getting as far as viewing my profile or CV has only happened a handful of times. We’re so, so far from acknowledgment or reply. My jobs come from direct approaches, very rarely the advertised ones.
Amanda Moran
@SarahLee Would it be worth having the job posts up for say a week, give the Production Companies the option to extend this if they haven't found the right candidate & give them the option to add 'Position Filled' to their post which could be left up for a little while for everyone to see. Not for the Production Companies to avoid contacting applicants, but to avoid wasting both parties time?
Amanda Moran
@SarahLee perhaps in the my job applications section additional buttons could be added where we can click for received response/ did not receive a response and then The Talent Manager would be able to see which companies are responding or not?
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Amanda Moran
@SarahLee perhaps there could be a similar set of buttons for the production companies to click, which would also act as visual reminder to acknowledge the applications, maybe it could also feature on the application emails received by the company?
Sarah Lee
@AmandaMoran thanks this is a great idea. The plan is to work on the redesign next week so I’ll feed your comments back to the team
Amanda Moran
@SarahLee Ah, I didn't mean to interrupt your weekend! I thought you might see my post on Monday! Thanks for responding and enjoy the rest of your weekend.
Deborah Roby
@SarahLee it's great to be acknowledged, but when it's generic and often makes little sense to what you IV for, getting feedback more often than not isn't valuable. However, thanks but no thanks should be part of the process; it's just rude to give radio silence after an IV.
Off the back of @LouGallagher and Read more
Off the back of @LouGallagher and @BecsHall's lovely posts and me encouraging others to similarly share, I knew I couldn't get away with not sharing too! My lovely Mum always used to say 'only ask of others what you ask of yourself' so on that note here goes but please BE WARNED this is NOT my natural habitat and maybe a tad underwhelming, ha.
Any who...
I am an ex TV Producer and have been in the TV Industry officially for 30 years in October. I worked in Docs, Science and Fact Ent for BBC and C4.
I have a 23 year old daughter and two sons 19 and 17. I live in North London and like swimming in cold water and eating out. I am a terrible cook. I run DV Talent with my husband. He is also my best friend, my biz partner, and my co-parent extraordinaire. We got married in 2022 when our kids were of an age to truly roast us with their speeches. They aced that one!
The middle one went off to Uni in September. ‘’Join loads of clubs,’’ we said. ‘’Meet new people,’’ we said. ‘’Broaden your mind,’’ we said. He's taken up cage-fighting!
I need coffee immediately when I wake up, or I know my whole day will be off. I have a mouth like an actual sailor. I love a cosmopolitan cocktail with Walkers cheese and onion crisps on the side. We have a Cockador dog Rocky who has a penchant for Gails croissants and joining people’s picnics. He is half Labrador half Cocker Spaniel. So obviously, ahem, we blame the breed.
Anyhow now that you know a fraction about me, let's connect!
Let's chat, let's engage, let's get this industry networking...
Any who...
I am an ex TV Producer and have been in the TV Industry officially for 30 years in October. I worked in Docs, Science and Fact Ent for BBC and C4.
I have a 23 year old daughter and two sons 19 and 17. I live in North London and like swimming in cold water and eating out. I am a terrible cook. I run DV Talent with my husband. He is also my best friend, my biz partner, and my co-parent extraordinaire. We got married in 2022 when our kids were of an age to truly roast us with their speeches. They aced that one!
The middle one went off to Uni in September. ‘’Join loads of clubs,’’ we said. ‘’Meet new people,’’ we said. ‘’Broaden your mind,’’ we said. He's taken up cage-fighting!
I need coffee immediately when I wake up, or I know my whole day will be off. I have a mouth like an actual sailor. I love a cosmopolitan cocktail with Walkers cheese and onion crisps on the side. We have a Cockador dog Rocky who has a penchant for Gails croissants and joining people’s picnics. He is half Labrador half Cocker Spaniel. So obviously, ahem, we blame the breed.
Anyhow now that you know a fraction about me, let's connect!
Let's chat, let's engage, let's get this industry networking...
Edited on 31st Jan 2024 17:11pm
67 Likes 
Emma Seagrove
Hello Sarah!
Sarah Lee
@EmmaSeagrove Hello! Hope all is good with you? Do share an 'about me' if you can. We'd love to hear more about you
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Emma Seagrove
@SarahLee done! Might need some help formatting the pics!
Lou Gallagher
@SarahLee cage fighting sounds a far wiser choice than working in TV right about now!!!!
Sarah Lee
@LouGallagher So true! It's probably a lot more lucrative too...
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Carla Francome
@SarahLee Love this! Need to pick your brains about cold water swimming!
Sarah Lee
@CarlaFrancome yes do. It’s the best!
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4 Likes
Julia Rooke
Its good. I like to see personal analytics and applicant numbers. I do think indies should be able to have a button they can press to respond to send out a generic rejection letter.
Sarah Lee
@JuliaRooke They do! Although we are in the process of making it easier for them to access this. Watch this space! And thanks for the feedback too btw
John Rey Malto
Very Satisfied ✅
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Carmen Wagner
It makes for me no sense....sorry
I just log on to the site normally..
While apps are quite practical, they permanently block storage space.
The only thing that is really annoying is the endless cookie lists that you have to click away..
A Button with:Only essential cookies, would be very helpful
Melissa Williams-Sambrano
It is easy to use and convenient. I am really satisfied with it.
Rashid Davari
It is good but if you can add an automatically applying function for a job with already prepared standard job application on one's file that would be very useful when one is on a go or in the middle of a job, to be able with a click of button apply for the job.
I do understand that sending individual job application is very important but what I'm suggesting is this function when one is not able to get to a computer and properly write an applications.
Phil Lindsay
@RashidDavari hi Rashid - the latest version of the app introduced a new feature which might help. Now when you apply for a job you can re-use any cover letter you have written for a previous application. Hope this helps!
Tim Clack
The TM mobile app makes it quicker and easier to check what's happening immediately, especially when your accessing the app every day.
Harry Christopher
I am new to using it but so far so good! I am finding that talent seems to be a great way to connect with people. Many thanks
Mark Guy
@SarahLee quite glitchy in places. Asks for my availability every time I log in. So needy! Haha
Sarah Lee
@MarkGuy sorry about that. Must be infuriating in this climate to be reminded you’re still available! I’ll speak to my colleague @PhilLindsay about a fix. thanks for the feedback
James Wright
Hello, this isn't exclusively about the app, but, on a few occasions I've noticed an employer will have read my cover letter but not downloaded my CV, but, the analytics shows that they have downloaded it. I wonder if it's possible that employers read the cover letter, look at the profile, then download the CV from the profile? That might be a problem if they're not downloading the CV I've curated specifically for them.
I don't know if that is actually what happens, but it might be worth TM looking in to and finding out. Thanks!
Julia Rooke
I think if an employer downloads your CV off your profile not your application it will most likely be your most recent CV, so likely to be the same one you sent .....it all a bit mysterious at times...
Andrea Florence
very happy with it!
Thankyou everyone for your continued support & trust in The Talent Manager this past... Read more
Thankyou everyone for your continued support & trust in The Talent Manager this past year
2023 has been a tough one -
But it's also been a real pleasure working to support such a resilient, tenacious and above all kind community.
I hope Xmas provides the break you deserve and you enjoy some time playing around with our brand new mobile app !
We developed it to help you build contacts and networks so you can start the New Year with your career foot forward.
The apps all about peer to peer support and broadening your exposure to more opportunities.
We hope it will transform the way our industry networks.
You can register for events and notify your contacts that you are going in the click of a button. In another click you can make a connection request with all of the other event attendees.
Of course we've built it so it's easier to apply for jobs too. Fingers crossed that in 2024 there are many more jobs than 2023 and plenty to go around.
Merry Christmas all....
2023 has been a tough one -
But it's also been a real pleasure working to support such a resilient, tenacious and above all kind community.
I hope Xmas provides the break you deserve and you enjoy some time playing around with our brand new mobile app !
We developed it to help you build contacts and networks so you can start the New Year with your career foot forward.
The apps all about peer to peer support and broadening your exposure to more opportunities.
We hope it will transform the way our industry networks.
You can register for events and notify your contacts that you are going in the click of a button. In another click you can make a connection request with all of the other event attendees.
Of course we've built it so it's easier to apply for jobs too. Fingers crossed that in 2024 there are many more jobs than 2023 and plenty to go around.
Merry Christmas all....
41 Likes 
Sheryl Sandler BFE
Thanks to ALL@TM for trying to keep us positive, not just through a bleak mid-winter but a bleak 2023. To those who really struggled and contemplated giving up, I hope you managed to hang in, to those who gave up, I guess there were some, I'm really sorry. To Lou and others like you, keep on tumbling and stumbling - if you can.
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